Let's discuss rankings?!

j.pardoube...

10 20

Posted Jan 06, 2009 23:01

Dear All,

since on the Internet there is sufficiently large number of MBA rankings and data in them frequently differs (especially when it?s about popularity of MBA school on the labor market or even specialization of this or that school in a certain sector of business/education) what is your opinion of the following rankings:

- Financial Times (Global MBA ranking)

http://rankings.ft.com/businessschoolrankings/global-mba-rankings

- Financial Times (Top-10 schools in Selected Categories)
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/3f930b0c-cb17-11dc-97ff-000077b07658.html

- Business Week (Global MBA ranking)
http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/rankings/

- Business Week (Best International Business Schools)
http://bwnt.businessweek.com/interactive_reports/mba_intl_2008/index.asp?sortCol=job_offers&sortOrder=2&pageNum=1&resultNum=100

- Business Week (Best US Business Schools)
http://bwnt.businessweek.com/interactive_reports/mba_domestic_2008/index.asp

- Business Week (International Specialty ranking)
http://bwnt.businessweek.com/bschools/graduate/08rankings/specialty_intl.asp

- Business Week (US Specialty ranking)
http://bwnt.businessweek.com/bschools/graduate/08rankings/specialty_usa.asp

- Business Week (Return on Investment ranking)
http://bwnt.businessweek.com/interactive_reports/roi_rankings/

- TopMBA (Top European Business Schools)
http://www.topmba.com/research/top_100_business_schools/4_top_business_schools/42_europe/

- TopMBA (Top US Business Schools)
http://www.topmba.com/research/top_100_business_schools/4_top_business_schools/41_north_america/

- WhichMBA (Global MBA ranking)
http://mba.eiu.com/index.asp?layout=2008rankings

Even if we do not pay special attention to the difference of the position of this or that school in different Global ratings, which is understandable, since the different systems of estimation can be used, still it would be desirable to possess a maximally precise information when when it?s about specialization of the school. I note that undoubtedly studying the ranking does NOT exclude contact with the school directly.

Business Week (Best International / Best US) gives an overview of possible job offers, TopMBA as well ? which information is more precise?

WhichMBA gives rather a detailed overview of each school?s features (if you follow the link of the school), like breadth of alumni network, faculty quality, diversity of recruiters ? which all of course is crucial, but there is no guarantee the quantity of information equals its quality. Actually no ranking gives any guarantee, thus ? finally -

which ranking would you use for estimating quality of education, career opportunities and in-school experience value???

If you used any of the above-mentioned rankings before entering the school and now you see the situation from inside, your opinion becomes even more interesting.

Thanks beforehand for sharing your thoughts.

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JohnnyL

60 120

Posted Jan 07, 2009 11:26

Dear all,

This my opinion about the rankings:

Financial Times: These rankings are very good. They focus on salary data of alumni, school diversity and research. However, there are a few weak points: Salary data is reported by the alumni. If a business school has very close ties to its alumni, it can instruct them in the right way... ;-) Research quality focuses on publications in 40 international journals, nearly all of them are pubished in the US or the UK. That means that schools located in those coutrnies have a clear advantage (in contrast to e.g. schools in France or Spain). Another problem that a program has to exist for a ceratin time (at least five years) to get admitted to the ranking. And one last thing: German ans Austrian schools reported me that they do not take the German and Austrain PhD students into account, since their system seems to be a little bit different from the UK/US system. This is a clear disadvantage for them in this area.

Business Week: The Business Week (and the Wall Street Journal too) focus on the North American market. For a school outside the US and Canada it is very, very hard to enter the ranking. I.e. the ranking is an important guideline for the US and Canadian market, but not more.

TopMBA: Be careful with that ranking! It is published by the organization that also organizes the World MBA Tour and publishes several MBA guides. There is always the danger that "good clients" (schools that book many fairs or ads) will benefit by a good ranking position.

WhichMBA: For me, this is the most detailed and comprehensive ranking. Entering the ranking seems to be very tough. It seems to me that only the well-established schools have a chance to reach top positions. It is also obvious that many UK schools are ranked.

I would also like the Eduniversal ranking which was published a few months ago. They compared business schools in all parts of the world. That means, they compare apples with oranges. You can find a detailed report about the ranking here: http://www.mba-channel.com/News/News/EBS_Ranking.html.

All in all, I think that rankings are a good guideline for a decision - no more, no less. It is the same with restaurants: Normally, star-rated restaurants should have a better quality than non-star-rated ones. On the other hand, I have been very disappointed by some star-rated restaurants, while having had delicious meals in restaurants which will never have the chance to get rated. May be the mixture of international ranking positions, national rankings, accreditations and the personal impression of the school, its students and alumni is the way to find the right MBA.

Best,
JL

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j.pardoube...

10 20

Posted Jan 07, 2009 18:40

Dear JL, thank you for a detailed and thoughtful answer. A couple of questions from my side:

Financial Times: These rankings are very good.
.........
Research quality focuses on publications in 40 international journals, nearly all of them are pubished in the US or the UK. That means that schools located in those coutrnies have a clear advantage (in contrast to e.g. schools in France or Spain).

Does it mean from your point of view that if any European school is placed at a worthy place in this ranking, there is sense to consider it (at least at preliminary stage) as "non low-grade" MBA?

Another problem that a program has to exist for a ceratin time (at least five years) to get admitted to the ranking.

And this strengthens the above-said... right?

Business Week: The Business Week (and the Wall Street Journal too) focus on the North American market. For a school outside the US and Canada it is very, very hard to enter the ranking.

On the one hand looks like the same story with European school mentioned in BW ranking.... But...

the ranking is an important guideline for the US and Canadian market, but not more.

.. on the other hand - I'm a bit confused with these words of yours. Do you mean BusinessWeek treats European schools like minor ones and thus the information may be not precise/correct?

I would also like the Eduniversal ranking which was published a few months ago. They compared business schools in all parts of the world.

If anyone is interested in this ranking, here is direct link to it: http://www.eduniversal.com/business-schools-ranking/select_area

All in all, I think that rankings are a good guideline for a decision - no more, no less. It is the same with restaurants: Normally, star-rated restaurants should have a better quality than non-star-rated ones. On the other hand, I have been very disappointed by some star-rated restaurants, while having had delicious meals in restaurants which will never have the chance to get rated.

Right you are! But when it's about distance learning (what I'm looking for) it's not easy to visit all the schools from your list, besides not all business schools have student-forums available for those from "outside".

Dear JL, thank you for a detailed and thoughtful answer. A couple of questions from my side:

<blockquote>
Financial Times: These rankings are very good.
.........
Research quality focuses on publications in 40 international journals, nearly all of them are pubished in the US or the UK. That means that schools located in those coutrnies have a clear advantage (in contrast to e.g. schools in France or Spain).
</blockquote>
Does it mean from your point of view that if any European school is placed at a worthy place in this ranking, there is sense to consider it (at least at preliminary stage) as "non low-grade" MBA?

<blockquote>
Another problem that a program has to exist for a ceratin time (at least five years) to get admitted to the ranking.
</blockquote>
And this strengthens the above-said... right?

<blockquote>
Business Week: The Business Week (and the Wall Street Journal too) focus on the North American market. For a school outside the US and Canada it is very, very hard to enter the ranking.
</blockquote>
On the one hand looks like the same story with European school mentioned in BW ranking.... But...

<blockquote>the ranking is an important guideline for the US and Canadian market, but not more.</blockquote>
.. on the other hand - I'm a bit confused with these words of yours. Do you mean BusinessWeek treats European schools like minor ones and thus the information may be not precise/correct?

<blockquote>
I would also like the Eduniversal ranking which was published a few months ago. They compared business schools in all parts of the world. </blockquote>
If anyone is interested in this ranking, here is direct link to it: http://www.eduniversal.com/business-schools-ranking/select_area

<blockquote>
All in all, I think that rankings are a good guideline for a decision - no more, no less. It is the same with restaurants: Normally, star-rated restaurants should have a better quality than non-star-rated ones. On the other hand, I have been very disappointed by some star-rated restaurants, while having had delicious meals in restaurants which will never have the chance to get rated. </blockquote>
Right you are! But when it's about distance learning (what I'm looking for) it's not easy to visit all the schools from your list, besides not all business schools have student-forums available for those from "outside".

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JohnnyL

60 120

Posted Jan 08, 2009 12:14

I am pleased to answer your questions. To keep the thread short, I will write my answers directly without quoting the question:

Q 1 + 2: I think a good position in the FT ranking should give you the guarantee that the school offers programs of a good quality. However, there are a couple of accredited schools from Scandinavia, Germany or France which offer a very good quality too, but their programs are too small or too young to get ranked.

Q 3 +4: Business Weel clearly focuses on the US market. For example, one pillar of the ranking is a recruiter survey in the US. Normally those guys know the number 50 school in the US better than the number 10 school in Europe. When you plan to work in the US after your MBA, Business Week can be helpful. If you consider to work elsewhere (Europe, Asia) Business Week is not the best source of information for you.

Eduniveral ranking: Be careful with this ranking! I know the German market very well and the facts that EBS is ranked 2nd in Germany or that Frankfurt School, ESMT or GISMA are rated "Excellent" make this ranking very questionable. Mannheim in the top position is ok, the ratings of WHU, Goethe, Münster and Cologne too.

Distance learning: This is really a problem, since in many countries a distance learning MBA is not considered to be a "real" MBA. E.g., the cross-cultural and team experience is missing in those programs.

Best,
JL

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j.pardoube...

10 20

Posted Jan 10, 2009 21:00

Many thanx, JL! That was helpful.

Jiri

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